老外讨论禁摩 是一种什么样的体验?

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文章来源: 龙腾网 作者:佚名

Lots of cities banned them because they are considered the chariot of the poor and make the city look "untidy".
So then all the chinese companies producing small motorbikes just started producing electric versions. Now all the poor people ride these because they're classed as electric bicycles and hence legal.
Cities CLAIMED they were banning motorbikes due to pollution but now some of these companies are even producing electric bikes with inbuilt gasoline generators to keep the battery charged.
So what you have now is all the poor people still driving around the cityon electric powered gasoline engine having bikes.
The law has lost its purpose so why even have it at this point?
dandmcd United States 22 points·1 day ago·edited 1 day ago
The noise pollution of the gas powered motorbikes wasone of the real issues not the fact that they are for the poor people. I visit the county of Foshan Shunde often or go into Panyu of Guangzhou and it is much noisier than being in the Guangzhou center. Also it has to cut downon the motorbike taxi beggar gangs in the cities that were a real nuisance (anyone in Guangzhou years ago could tell you how huge of a problem they were)。
Also the regulations for bikes and motorbikes are really shitty so it was easier to ban them instead of having constant traffic headaches since motorbike owners believe they can rideon the road sidewalk wherever there is concrete and the laws are too lax to punish them. Since the police prefer to use cameras instead of officerson the street they can't catch the numerous motorbikes speeding through red lights or drivingon busy pedestrian sidewalks.
Electric bikes are also banned in many areas. You must have a business license to rideone like McDonalds or Meituan riders. Package delivery drivers like SF and Jingdong now must use licensed 3 wheel electric vehicles with company logos the old shitty wagon in the back style are banned and being phased out.
I haven't observed any of these hybrid bikes yet but if it has gasoline power it can be confiscated by the police. I've seen people lose their electric bikes before in a crackdown.
Geek_Fortress_China 1 point·12 hours ago
In a perfect world the city governments would start phasing out petrol engine cars as well in the next few years as soon as sufficient domestic-market electric cars are available.
Just imagine the quiet clear air if Beijing prohibited all petrol engines inside the second ring road and then expanded that ban ring road by ring road until the whole city center was nothing but electric cars and electric bikes. Think of the peace and quiet! Think of the slightly fresher air!
PM-ME-YUAN 0 points·1 day ago
Noise? What about cars? They make noise too. That's almost as bad an excuse to ban them as the "pollution" angle. Since cars produce more pollution than bikes.
dandmcd United States 12 points·1 day ago
Noise of any motorbikes are higher decibel than any common caron the road. Cars these days are whisper quiet and very few drive around a loud old clunker in China.
PM-ME-YUAN 0 points·1 day ago
So make the law saying it's illegal to have a motorbike exhaust which produces higher than a certain decibel. This is what literally every other country that is not China does rather than just flat ban motorbikes.
And have you ever heard a Ferrari or Lambo? They're loud as hell.
dandmcd United States 3 points·1 day ago
There's more thanone reason motorbikes were banned. They were banned due to noise pollution safety concerns lack of insurance regulation (nobody wants to insure motorbikes in this country) and exhaust pollution. It wasn't justone excuse. And to be fair to the governments thinking about pollution they have already switched a good majority of their bus fleets to electric and hybrids and made some of the toughest green standards for vehicles in the world so they clearly have a goal in mind to remove the countries dependencyon oil but also reduce noise pollution across the board which is a huge issue in a dense large city.
goodguyonline 3 points·1 day ago
Also thieveson motorbikes. There used to be bao an'son the corners with 2-3 meter long Vaudeville-esque hook-poles to deter thieveson bikes.
PM-ME-YUAN -6 points·1 day ago·edited 1 day ago
So how come the west doesn't seem to have any of these issues despite not banning motorbikes?
They can throw out any excuses they want but the REAL reason they're banned is because poor people ride them and the government hates poor people.
You can tell this is the true reason because lots of Chinese cities have now started offering expensive motorbike registration plates to allow rich people to ride expensive motorbikes this was pushed through by Chinese wing of Harley Davidsons and Ducati.
As someone who has a legally registered motorbike withone of these plates (who has to travel to a small town 60km away from the city whenever I need to do anything registration wise) it's just annoying.
I'm getting around the law by paying money and registering outside the city the poor people are getting around the law by riding ebikes. The law is pointless and just makes people's lives 麻烦
xiefeilaga 6 points·1 day ago
[has to travel to a small town 60km away from the city whenever I need to do anything registration wise]
I hate to break it to you but you're driving illegally in whatever city you're in. Your bike may be legally registered as in it legally belongs to you but they can still fine you and maybe even take your bike away because they're not allowed in your city. You're getting away with it because they're focusingon other things at the moment.
[this was pushed through by Chinese wing of Harley Davidson and Ducati.]
No. If they had any pull then there really would be some expensive plate you could get to legally drive in your city. People have been getting their motorcycles registered in small towns for as long as I've been here which is long before any Chinese cities banned motorcycles. Even when motorcycles were allowed in the cities they were generally limited to around 100cc. Ducati and Harley didn't lobby the government to make them a loophole. It's just that the bike dealers seek out connections who can set those registrations up because if they didn't they'd have a hell of a time selling bikes. They've always had to do this because those big fast bikes have never really been allowed in the cities.
[They can throw out any excuses they want but the REAL reason they're banned is because poor people ride them and the government hates poor people.]
Nope but you came within a few miles of guessing why they're so reluctant to crack downon e-bikes: poor people. While city governments dragged their feet e-bikes became a major transportation tool for China's urban working class and even lower middle class.
If you actually went and looked at the lawson the books in your city I'm guessing many of the most popular models would technically be illegal. In Beijing any e-bike that doesn't have backup pedals is actually illegal. But the cities dragged their feet setting up some kind of enforcement mechanism to stop people from selling overpowered bikes and to license them in some way and the bikes took over.
Now we're going to start seeing cities trying to rein them in but they'll be careful because they don't want to piss off such a large constituent group. I know Chengdu has banned them in the city center except for bikes registered for commercial purposes. Kunming has tried a few times to set up a registration system but Kunming really sucks at urban management。
I still think they're better than the motorbikes. The vast majority of e-bikes are incapable of reaching even the speed of a small gas motorbike they're a lot quieter and of course they're cleaner.
They probably do need to start making people get licenses and follow traffic laws though.
aghicantthinkofaname 1 point·22 hours ago
Western cities are built around cars
FileError214 1 point·18 hours ago
I thought this was pretty much just American cities. Aren’t European cities pretty good for walking/biking and public transit?
aghicantthinkofaname 2 points·16 hours ago
Really dependson the country. Holland and Denmark are probably the big two but this is a recent thing as well. Most other cities have plenty infrastructure for cars. I have no idea why more people don't use motorbikes and scooters in those places. Maybe the weather encourages cars for distance travelling and for short distances people prefer bikes for health reasons?
FileError214 1 point·15 hours ago
One interesting thing that seems to be happening in American cities is that as urban sprawl continues the city center becomes more walkable/bikeable. When I was growing up our downtown was deserted (except for the homeless). Now more and more offices are turning into condos and people are actually living there and embracing the walking/biking and even scooter lifestyle.
Hairofthe 2 points·18 hours ago
[Noise? What about cars? They make noise too]
This is just silly. Cars are already bad and you want to make things worse by adding something even more annoying and louder? I'm delighted motorbikes are banned in my city the oddone that does come roaring through is annoying enough turning the place into Hanoi would probably be enough to make me leave
jiang_zemin Mongolia 8 points·1 day ago
Electronic bikes are a necessary evil. Everyone from your kuaidi to nainai with a cart full of boxes uses them. There is no alternative to this to fit a city of millions.
HotNatured United States 2 points·1 day ago
Yeah it's crazy how insanely good public transport is here yet the bikes are still clearly a necessity.
I just wish that they were better regulated such as forced to obey red lights made to stay off sidewalks and penalized for carrying dangerous loads.
PM-ME-YUAN 3 points·1 day ago
It's better than America but "insanely good" is a massive overstatement. You're still crammingon sweat boxes and having to stand shoulder to shoulder with everyone as you spend an houron a 10KM journey.
On an ebike I can do the same journey in 20 minutes in comfort.
HotNatured United States 1 point·23 hours ago
Yeah that's a fair point. Here in Shanghai I generally prefer (shared) biking for anything under say 6km because it doesn't lose me too much time if any. Dependson the area too as this central area is just way more pleasanton the bike.
omkmg United States 4 points· 1 day ago
I like motorcycles. I live in a smaller city that still has motorcycles and they are mostly not a problem. But they can be pretty loud. I am sometimes woken up by some douche (or douches) reving at like 2-3 am. Also motorcycles can pretty much go as fast as cars. Electric bikes generally avoid major car roads (they are supposed to stay in the bike lane) because (unmodified) ebikes can't reach car speeds. Motorcycles can swerve and cut through regular traffic in a way that could be pretty dangerous for inconsiderate unaware and/or naive car drivers. My friend from my previous city which does ban motorcycles got into a pretty bad accident because of this. I can imagine that bigger cities ban them for safety and also because the reving noise can be overwhelming at times.
WhereTheHotWaterAt 3 points·1 day ago
Electric bikes are unfortunately necessary to daily life and fast delivery. Unlike motorcycle they're not noisy which is good. I think it's an okay compromise. If you ban them too how will the vast majority of people without a car move around?
What they could do is beeing more stricton the traffic rules though... Also ban them in pedestrian areas.
ssdv80gm2 3 points·23 hours ago
Because 99% of Chinese 2-wheele riders are making traffic unnecessarily dangerous by ignoring all traffic rules. In my city motorbikes as well as most electric bikes are banned and it makes driving so much safer.
Theonly deadly accidents that I've seen so far involved e-bikes... it's shocking to see a dead body lyingon the street but I'm not surprised. It's the result of a 100% lack of common sense combined with an active ignorance of traffic regulations.
PM-ME-YUAN 2 points·23 hours ago·edited 23 hours ago
Cars get into far more accidents than motorbikes though. The dangerous roads in China are caused by the pig-headed car drivers that think they're invincible and everyone else is a lower form of life that needs to get out their way. I bet that fatality was the fault of the car driver not the e-bike. I frequently see ebike riders taken out by idiot car drivers turning right when ebikes have right of way.
ssdv80gm2 2 points·21 hours ago
[I bet that fatality was the fault of the car driver not the e-bike.]
The e-bike driver was riding in the wrong directionon the over-take lineon a bridge 3 lanes + emergency line in each direction... how is this the fault of the car driver? Not to mention that e-bikes where prohibited to driveon that bridge. Ignoring that there would have been a emergency line with no cars drivingon it.
Chinese people are horrible drivers but e-bikes riders are worse than everything elseon Chinese roads.
There are a lot of car accidents but most of them areonly material damage.
PlueberryBancakes 1 point·18 hours ago
[pig-headed car drivers]
[The e-bike driver was riding in the wrong direction]
Conclusion: everyone drives like a twat.
leanhsi Great Britain 1 point·22 hours ago
Right of Way in China is not like in most other places...
Calver-o 2 points·19 hours ago
They sure as hell aren't enforcing where the bikes are allowed to go. Kuaidi guys riding through pedestrian sidewalks and spamming their horn gets kinda rodonkulous. If the rules were enforced they would be much more tolerable.
PM-ME-YUAN 2 points·18 hours ago
tbh the kaudi guys have to drive like that to make the delivery times.
MikeLaoShi Scotland 2 points·1 day ago
Answer: because Chinese traffic is fucking dangerous enough already without the higher cc motorbikes screaming around.
PM-ME-YUAN -1 points·1 day ago
That's not the fault of motorbikes though. It's the cars causing the danger so why do they get a free pass? Should ban cars lol.
leanhsi Great Britain 2 points·22 hours ago
Absolutely. No city in the world should allow private cars. China should lead he way.
MikeLaoShi Scotland 1 point·21 hours ago
Yeah I'm not against that idea either. Make all do a "real" driving test and institute severe penalties (such as removing the license to drive completely) for any kind of road safety infraction (like driving without wearing a seat belt turning/switching lanes without indicating etc) and we'll be a long way towards the goal of reducing the number of carson the road in short order.
PlueberryBancakes 1 point·18 hours ago
Cars are typically driven by wealthier people who might present problems to your everyday traffic cop if they're stopped for breaking road laws.
Motorcycles and scooters are peasant-mobiles and so cops can focuson them with impunity.
Chinese driving conditions won't change until road law enforcement becomes a reality.
FileError214 0 points·17 hours ago
“Cars are typically driven by wealthier people”
It’s not 1997. Plenty of average Zhous have cars now.
PlueberryBancakes 2 points·17 hours ago
Average in a big city is still far higheron the totem pole than your typical scooter driver or motorcycle taxi guy. My point stands.
FileError214 0 points·17 hours ago
Your point that cars are typically driven by wealthy people? No that doesn’t stand. That’s not true. How much does a QQ car or a Wuling van cost?only rich people can afford them?
PlueberryBancakes 1 point·16 hours ago·edited 16 hours ago
You're really starting to move the goalposts here with your cherry-picking. The greater point in my comment was that the police disproportionately target motorcycles and scooters for enforcement while allowing many cars to slideon by because the former tend to be driven by people without the means to protest or fight back. Your cheap vehicle examples would also fall into this category.
Sure you'll see your occasional migrant van pulled over but if you think fancy sedans are getting stoppedon the reg you're making things up.
I don't think you're arguing in good faith so I'll stop here.
FileError214 1 point·16 hours ago
Of course luxury cars get a pass. Rich people can do whatever they want and the poor people usually get fucked over. I agree with your overall points I just disagree with your assertion that everyone with a car is wealthy. Have you ever been to a village during Spring Festival?
LeYanYan France 1 point·1 day ago
In Shenzhen-Longgang I choose to walkon bicycle's lane because it's theonly place where there isn't eBikes assholes riding frenetically.
seilgu2 1 point·23 hours ago
Visit Taipei and you'll understand the banon motorbikes.
shenzhenren 0 points·22 hours ago
I feel like Taiwan makes motorbikes work though. If you really want to see crazy motorbike riders you should visit Vietnam.
educo_ United States 1 point·20 hours ago
Truth! It's like the two-wheel traffic in China but with loud gas guzzling engines and no separate bike lanes.
DanSensei 1 point·1 hour ago
Don't they ban then for all but uniformed workers of kuaidi and waimai in some cities? Their drivers are so extremely lawless I personally think thats the route all cities should take.
I think they also been freight tricycles (those guys creating noise pollution by ringing a bell all day and carrying boxes.) I say goodon that front too. Don't need that noise pollution.
PM-ME-YUAN 1 point·1 hour ago
You shouldn't really be happy that things get banned you're taking away people's freedom. There's plenty of people in China who love to ride motorbikes in a safe and legal way.

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